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Ceisteanna — Questions Oral Answers. - Cleaning and Heating of Schools.

Thursday, 29 September 1966

Dáil Éireann Debate
Vol. 224 No. 3

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41.

Mr. Corish: Information on Brendan Corish Zoom on Brendan Corish asked the Minister for Education when the last increase was granted in the amount allowed for the heating and cleaning of national schools; what was the size of such increase; what is the present annual allowance for this purpose for each [426] school; and if any increase in these grants will be made in the near future.

Mr. Colley: Information on George Colley Zoom on George Colley The last increase in these grants was made in the school year 1963-64. The average increase in grant per school was 66 per cent. A further increase in these grants is not at present contemplated.

As the information in relation to the present rates of grant is in tabular form, I propose, a Cheann Comhairle, with your permission, to have it circulated with the Official Report.

Following is the information:

HEATING AND CLEANING OF NATIONAL SCHOOLS.

RATES OF GRANT.

HEATING.

Size of School (Number of Teachers) Heating System
Low Pressure Hot Water Electric Thermal Storage Other
  £ £ £
1 11 14 8
2 19 23 15
3 25 30 21
4 33 35 27
5 41 44 33
  Plus £8* Plus £9* Plus £6*

*For each additional teacher on the recognised staff.

ASSEMBLY HALLS.

(of area 1,500 sq. ft. and over)...£28.

CLEANING.

Size of School (Number of Teachers) Schools where a cleaner is regularly employed from day to day Other Schools
Materials Services Total
  £ £ £ £
1 1 18 19 8
2 2 25 27 13
3 3 34 37 16
4 4 40 44 19
5 5 46 51 22
6 6 52 58 25
7 7 58 65 28
8 8 64 72 31
9 9 69 78 34
10 10 75 85 37
11 11 81 (max). 92 40
12 12 81 93 43
  Plus £1*     Plus £3

*For each additional teacher on the recognised staff.

[427]Mr. Cluskey: Information on Frank Cluskey Zoom on Frank Cluskey Will the Minister contemplate increasing the grant in view of the seven per cent on the ESB charges?

Mr. Colley: Information on George Colley Zoom on George Colley No.

Mr. Corish: Information on Brendan Corish Zoom on Brendan Corish Will the Minister say that the grant which is given to these schools is the only amount which is used for cleaning and lighting.

Mr. Colley: Information on George Colley Zoom on George Colley It is not intended as such.

Mr. Corish: Information on Brendan Corish Zoom on Brendan Corish I should like to know more about this.

Mr. Colley: Information on George Colley Zoom on George Colley It is intended to be a grant towards the cost.

Mr. Corish: Information on Brendan Corish Zoom on Brendan Corish Who is to pay the rest?

Mr. Colley: Information on George Colley Zoom on George Colley It seems to me that it should be clear that with the nature of our national schools, which are parochial schools, that the obligation to contribute something towards cleaning and maintenance is one which clearly lies on the parish.

Mr. Corish: Information on Brendan Corish Zoom on Brendan Corish The State has a responsibility to educate these people and has accepted it.

Mr. L'Estrange: Information on Gerald L'Estrange Zoom on Gerald L'Estrange Free education for all.

Mr. Corish: Information on Brendan Corish Zoom on Brendan Corish Surely it should also accept the obligation of heating, cleaning and lighting the schools?

Mr. Colley: Information on George Colley Zoom on George Colley The Deputy is aware that our system of national school education is one that evolved in the course of our history and is not comparable with that of any other country. If you like, it is a kind of compromise between the parents on the one hand and the Church authorities and the State on the other. The State, as the Deputy knows, contributes the vast bulk of the cost but if these are to be parochial schools, if the system is to continue as at present, it seems to me not unreasonable that the parish should contribute something towards the cost.

Mr. Corish: Information on Brendan Corish Zoom on Brendan Corish Would the Minister [428] say who has the responsibility—the parents or the manager?

Mr. Colley: Information on George Colley Zoom on George Colley The manager.

Mr. Corish: Information on Brendan Corish Zoom on Brendan Corish The manager is supposed to get the money by way of raffle, by going around with the hat or something like that?

Mr. Colley: Information on George Colley Zoom on George Colley The sum involved if the schools are maintained normally and regularly is not very great.

Mr. Corish: Information on Brendan Corish Zoom on Brendan Corish Is the Minister aware or was it brought to his notice that there was a meeting of managers recently—Catholic managers, priests —and they protested. As far as I remember, they asked the Minister for Education to increase the amount substantially.

Mr. Colley: Information on George Colley Zoom on George Colley I am not specifically aware of that.

Mr. Corish: Information on Brendan Corish Zoom on Brendan Corish The inference is they did not accept the responsibility for providing the balance. If this is the situation, I think the Minister ought to talk to them about it to see who has the responsibility of making sure that these schools are adequately heated and cleaned.

Mr. Lindsay: Information on Patrick James Lindsay Zoom on Patrick James Lindsay As it is well known that this is a matter of perennial irritation and agitation in various parts, I take it that whatever irritation and agitation arise the responsibility for the contribution of small amounts will be removed from the educational scheme from 1st September, 1967.

Mr. O'Leary: This will be one of the details.

Mr. Lindsay: Information on Patrick James Lindsay Zoom on Patrick James Lindsay This will be one of the details and will be dealt with.

Mr. Colley: Information on George Colley Zoom on George Colley I am not aware that the Minister for Education made any statement that would lead the Deputy by any stretch of the imagination to arrive at that conclusion.


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