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27/06/2013 [Bills] SECTION 1Vol-224 Book-6
27/06/2013 [Bills] I welcome the Minister to the House. Amendments Nos. 1, 27 and 29 are related and may be discussed together by agreement of the House. Is that agreed? Agreed.[Wilson, Diarmuid]Vol-224 Book-6 Page [496]
27/06/2013 [Bills] I wish to read something into the record to enable Report Stage amendments to be taken later on. The Minister of State, Deputy Brian Hayes, on Second Stage flagged the fact I would table an amendment to the Central Bank Act 1971 to provide an authorisation regime for branches of third count...Vol-224 Book-6 Page [496]
27/06/2013 [Bills] Amendments Nos. 2 to 13, inclusive, and 18 are related and may be discussed together by agreement.[Mooney, Paschal]Vol-224 Book-6 Page [496]
27/06/2013 [Bills] I move amendment No. 2:
In page 10, subsection (1), line 28, to delete “regulated”.
I do not know what the Minister's travel schedule must look like these days but he is very welcome. My amendments aim to strengthen and support the Minister. They are suggestions.[Barrett, Sean D.]
Vol-224 Book-6 Page [497]
27/06/2013 [Bills] The Minister is very welcome. I did not expect to see him today. The saints have the ability of bilocation or multi-location and the Minister seems to be able to do the same thing himself as well.
I add my voice of support to Senator Barrett. When I first saw the amendment I did not und...
Vol-224 Book-6 Page [497]
27/06/2013 [Bills] The effect of amendment No. 7 would be to include the following within the definitions of financial service provider and related undertaking: auditors, accountants, pension fund trustees, building societies, debt collection agencies, moneylenders and other financial services as determined by...Vol-224 Book-6 Page [498]
27/06/2013 [Bills] I thank the Minister, as always, for his response. The Minister mentioned section 4. For clarification, the version I have has a miniscule section 4 dealing with repeals and revocations? Does the Minister refer to section 4 of today’s Bill? Perhaps he might advise me in that regard.[Barr...Vol-224 Book-6 Page [499]
27/06/2013 [Bills] It is Part 4 not section 4.[Noonan, Michael]Vol-224 Book-6 Page [499]
27/06/2013 [Bills] I thank the Minister, I misheard him previously. I have taken a note of that. That is important. I welcome that also.
I am concerned about the broad remit of financial services that trustees of pension funds seem to be boasting that they are hundreds of millions in debt. Some of them t...
Vol-224 Book-6 Page [499]
27/06/2013 [Bills] I agree with the sentiments expressed by the Senator. The days of light-touch regulation are long since behind us and it was a mistake that they ever were brought in. The former Minister for Justice, Equality and Law Reform, Michael McDowell, chaired the particular committee which gave ris...Vol-224 Book-6 Page [500]
27/06/2013 [Bills] I again thank the Minister for his comments on the aforementioned debt payment agencies and am obliged to him.[Barrett, Sean D.]Vol-224 Book-6 Page [500]
27/06/2013 [Bills] I move amendment No. 14:
In page 19, subsection (1), line 1, after “records” to insert “, computer records, tapes and other recordings”.
This amendment is to be inserted after the line in section 23(1) stating "The Bank may require that information, records or other documents". I do not kno...
Vol-224 Book-6 Page [501]
27/06/2013 [Bills] Amendment No. 14 in the name of Senator Barrett seeks to include computer records, tapes and other recordings in the definition of "record". Section 2 of the Central Bank Act 1942 defines "record" as follows:
'record' means any record of information, however compiled, recorded or stored, an...
Vol-224 Book-6 Page [501]
27/06/2013 [Bills] We should probably pay tribute to the framers of the Central Bank Act 1942 because they had a remarkable ability to predict what kind of technology would exist in 2013. I thank the Minister and will not push the amendment.[Barrett, Sean D.]Vol-224 Book-6 Page [502]
27/06/2013 [Bills] Amendments Nos. 15 and 19 are related and may be discussed together by agreement. Is that agreed? Agreed.[Mooney, Paschal]Vol-224 Book-6 Page [502]
27/06/2013 [Bills] I move amendment No. 15:
In page 27, line 19, after "auditing." to insert the following:
"The Bank shall conduct and publish research on standards for assurance and auditing and shall be the authority for stipulating and regulating such standards.".
Section 27BA(9) as inserted by section 35 ...
Vol-224 Book-6 Page [502]
27/06/2013 [Bills] The Bill already moves into the space where the Senator indicates it should go while, at the same time, allowing the Irish Auditing and Accounting Supervisory Authority to be the primary regulator of auditors and accountants. Amendments Nos. 15 and 19 seek to make the Central Bank responsib...Vol-224 Book-6 Page [502]
27/06/2013 [Bills] I thank the Minister. I accept what he says but as a Member of the House, I think the citizens might like to hear the odd noise out of the Irish Auditing and Accounting Supervisory Authority. It seemed to be remarkably silent at a period when such damage had been done to the country. That...Vol-224 Book-6 Page [503]
27/06/2013 [Bills] I have a specific question on this section. There was a peculiar case in 2007 where a whistleblower in UniCredit Bank in the IFSC allegedly reported alleged breaches of liquidity ratios. However, when he pursued it, it was discovered that, as the person responsible for ensuring the liquidi...Vol-224 Book-6 Page [504]
27/06/2013 [Bills] Amendment No. 16 seeks to require the Central Bank to publish in its annual report a statement of the employment status of persons reporting breaches and a statement of the reforms undertaken by the body in respect of which the report of breaches was made.
It is important that the identity...
Vol-224 Book-6 Page [504]
27/06/2013 [Bills] I look forward to discussing this again on Report Stage if the Senator frames an amendment. The Minister for Public Expenditure and Reform is introducing comprehensive legislation in the area of whistleblowing. The protections in this Bill may need to be examined in respect of that Bill be...Vol-224 Book-6 Page [506]
27/06/2013 [Bills] Like my colleague Senator Barrett, I would like longer to reflect on the section and to return to it on Report Stage. The complexity of the management structures of some of the financial institutions and the sheer dishonesty of the attitudes in them requires us to give this matter more deep...Vol-224 Book-6 Page [506]
27/06/2013 [Bills] Question put and agreed to.Vol-224 Book-6
27/06/2013 [Bills] I move amendment No. 17:
In page 33, subsection (3), line 36, after “exceed” to insert “triple”.
Section 43(3) reads: "In subsection (1) “appropriate redress” means such monetary or other redress as is specified in the direction and (in the case of redress for pecuniary loss) as does not exc...
Vol-224 Book-6 Page [506]
27/06/2013 [Bills] Amendment No. 17 seeks to provide for redress of up to three times the amount of the loss incurred by persons affected. The purpose of redress is not to punish the financial service provider but to ensure that the person affected is put back to the position he or she would have been in had ...Vol-224 Book-6 Page [506]
27/06/2013 [Bills] I move amendment No. 20:
In page 44, subsection (1), between lines 4 and 5, to insert the following:
“(c) in the case of the so-called pillar banks shall consult with the Competition Authority and the National Competitiveness Council on the impact of the proposed regulations on the non-banki...
Vol-224 Book-6 Page [507]
27/06/2013 [Bills] The amendment seeks to require the Central Bank to consult with the Competition Authority and the National Competitiveness Council on the impact of the proposed regulations affecting the pillar banks on the non-banking economy. Section 49 already allows for the Central Bank to consult any e...Vol-224 Book-6 Page [507]
27/06/2013 [Bills] Is there a possibility the phrase "any other body" is too vague? As consumers, we want to have specified bodies referred to. Referring to "any other body" allows for discretion when society wants better value from Irish banks. I am sure the Governor and his very able staff will consult th...Vol-224 Book-6 Page [508]
27/06/2013 [Bills] A valid point is raised by the Senator in respect of the lack of competition in the Irish financial services industry, particularly in respect of the domestic economy. There is a danger of a duopoly being controlled by two banks. One approach is to get the economy growing and make it worth...Vol-224 Book-6 Page [508]
27/06/2013 [Bills] I thank the Minister. We developed a banking system that was based solely on property. Bankers played golf with builders and built up house prices. The expertise for SMEs to which the Minister referred will be welcome. He will get strong support from these benches.[Barrett, Sean D.]Vol-224 Book-6 Page [508]
27/06/2013 [Bills] Amendments Nos. 21 and 22 are related and may be discussed together by agreement. Is that agreed? Agreed.[An Cathaoirleach]Vol-224 Book-6 Page [509]
27/06/2013 [Bills] I move amendment No. 21:
In page 49, between lines 39 and 40, to insert the following:
" 'debt collector' means a person who for remuneration collects or seeks to collect consumer credit debt;".
This matter was debated in the Dáil on Report Stage, but it was shifted to the justice portfolio....
Vol-224 Book-6 Page [509]
27/06/2013 [Bills] I welcome the opportunity to contribute on this matter. I raised it previously in respect of lending institutions that hire unsavoury agents with shady backgrounds to collect debts. It is not tolerable that people can break into someone's property, pose as debt collectors and effectively u...Vol-224 Book-6 Page [509]
27/06/2013 [Bills] Amendments Nos. 21 and 22 seek to make provision for debt collectors and debt collection services. As the Minister for Finance, I have no responsibility for the regulation of debt collectors and debt collecting firms. Debt collection services apply across a significantly wider range of act...Vol-224 Book-6 Page [509]
27/06/2013 [Bills] I will draw the Central Bank's attention to this short debate on this set of amendments today. I shall ask it to look at the views expressed by Senators Michael D'Arcy and Kathryn Reilly to see if, in its opinion, any further action is necessary.[Noonan, Michael]Vol-224 Book-6 Page [510]
27/06/2013 [Bills] Is the amendment being pressed?[An Cathaoirleach]Vol-224 Book-6 Page [510]
27/06/2013 [Bills] No, based on what the Minister has just said. I shall read his comments later.[Reilly, Kathryn]Vol-224 Book-6 Page [510]
27/06/2013 [Bills] Amendments Nos. 23 and 24 are related and may be discussed together.[An Cathaoirleach]Vol-224 Book-6 Page [511]
27/06/2013 [Bills] I move amendment No. 23:
In page 55, line 38, to delete “€10,000,000” and substitute “€50,000,000”.
As I understand it, the penalties under the 1942 Act are doubled but inflation has increased far more. I would hate to think that the penalties were being reduced in real terms. It is okay i...
Vol-224 Book-6 Page [511]
27/06/2013 [Bills] These amendments seek to increase the maximum penalty under the administrative sanction regime tenfold, from €500,000 to €5 million for an individual and from €5 million to €50 million for a body corporate. It is important that the fines are of sufficient scale to act as a deterrent to thos...Vol-224 Book-6 Page [511]
27/06/2013 [Bills] I thank the Minister. As always, I sought harsher fines. If we were trying to do the reverse I do not think that any Member of the House would be happy to take a doubling of his or her 1942 salary and expect to live on that sum. It would be a reduction in real terms.
I appreciate that t...
Vol-224 Book-6 Page [511]
27/06/2013 [Bills] I wish to make a point for the sake of the record. The base legislation is the 1942 Act but I believe that the penalties have been updated more than once in the meantime.[Noonan, Michael]Vol-224 Book-6 Page [512]
27/06/2013 [Bills] I move amendment No. 25:
In page 59, between lines 12 and 13, to insert the following:
“(d) the responses of the financial service provider to complaints made under this section.”.
My amendment deals with the ombudsman's report and its content. The section contains excellent material such a...
Vol-224 Book-6 Page [512]
27/06/2013 [Bills] The amendment seeks to require the Financial Services Ombudsman to include in its report the responses of the financial services provider to complaints made and reported by the Financial Services Ombudsman. However, I am satisfied that the naming provisions provided for in the Bill are...[N...Vol-224 Book-6 Page [512]
27/06/2013 [Bills] We have serial offenders and I would impose harsher fines on them. However, I will not press my amendment and thank the Minister for his response.[Barrett, Sean D.]Vol-224 Book-6 Page [512]
27/06/2013 [Bills] This is a technical amendment. The amendment involves an amendment to section 47 of the Central Bank and Credit Institutions (Resolution) Act 2011. It is a drafting amendment and is consequential on changes made to section 46 of the 2011 Act on Report Stage in the Dáil.[Noonan, Michael]Vol-224 Book-6 Page [513]
27/06/2013 [Bills] This amendment is technical in nature and is designed to remedy an incorrect reference in the Central Bank and Credit Institutions (Resolution) Act 2011. The objective of this amendment is to ensure the Central Bank is legally able to share confidential information to facilitate the Central...Vol-224 Book-6 Page [515]
27/06/2013 [Bills] It is interesting we are inserting new sections and making amendments. The irony is not lost on me that this is being done in the Seanad. Given the proposed abolition of the Seanad, perhaps the Minister will mention to the Taoiseach that these mistakes were made in Dáil Éireann or that the...Vol-224 Book-6 Page [515]
27/06/2013 [Bills] I thank Senators for the expeditious handling of this important legislation on Committee Stage. In particular, I thank Senator Barrett who did most of the heavy lifting today.[Noonan, Michael]Vol-224 Book-6 Page [515]
27/06/2013 [Bills] I thank the Minister and wish him well.[Barrett, Sean D.]Vol-224 Book-6 Page [515]
27/06/2013 [Bills] When is it proposed to take Report Stage?[An Cathaoirleach]Vol-224 Book-6 Page [515]
27/06/2013 [Bills] Next Tuesday.[D'Arcy, Michael]Vol-224 Book-6 Page [515]
27/06/2013 [Bills] When is it proposed to sit again?[An Cathaoirleach]Vol-224 Book-6 Page [515]
27/06/2013 [Bills] At 2.30 p.m. on Tuesday, 2 July 2013.[D'Arcy, Michael]Vol-224 Book-6 Page [515]
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